remindmeofthe | (no subject)

I don't really know what I thought of that.

Can I just say that I have NEVER GOTTEN SO BORED SO QUICKLY WITH A SHIP IN MY ENTIRE LIFE AS A FANGIRL OF ANYTHING EVER?

I mean. Imagine a relationship on TV. I know, it's a stretch, but stay with me. Now imagine that that relationship made its first canon appearance four episodes after one of its participants declared his intention to watch the other die slowly and painfully. Still with me? Now imagine that the entire rest of the relationship is afforded a similar amount of development. Ninety percent of it occurs offscreen. Imagine, in short, that it is badly written, undeveloped, and ill-defined.

Do you care about this relationship? Because I sure don't. Oh, I got tricked into it at first, 'cause here's the twist - it's a canon gay relationship on a relatively mainstream show, AND it's not one of those situations where the couple never gets to do more than hold hands. It's the kind of relationship that heretofore existed only in fanfic. How could I not be completely stoked when I was first getting into the show, before I'd seen exactly how it was handled?

Now I wish to Christ that there would be a scene with Jack and Ianto just holding hands. Because, now that I'm over the initial shock of wish fulfilment, I see absolutely no reason whatsoever to give a flying fuck about this pairing, and the only reaction I had to their scene in this episode was, "Oh, shit, the fangirls. The ship wars. Make it the fuck STOP."

That's all I got for the Jack/Ianto ship. Until there is any sort of development other than "they look hot when they make out" (which, yes, not incorrect) I just don't. care.

And speaking of poorly developed! Ianto. I was so intrigued by your actions in this episode, especially in light of the discussion I've been having with

apiphile about Jack's control issues and the fact that the team never says boo to him about it. Are these the stirrings of your latent personality? Because, I've been thinking about you a lot lately what with the major role you play in my latest fic 'verse and all, and I've realized that I have no clue how to write you. And it's not because you're so complex and all over the place, like the Doctor (another character I really can't get a handle on as a writer), it's because you're the most vaguely written character on the show. This is not your fault. But now I feel like I have something I might be able to get hold of.

I don't even know about the rest of the episode, guys. Jack is a drama queen who trusts no one and Gwen charges blindly ahead and proves him right. I enjoyed the plot until the last five minutes or so when my brain kind of got broken, but it still beat the living hell out of last week's ep simply by dint of being coherent. I did have a much better time watching it than this entry would imply. I just don't have a lot to say about it.

Only two episodes to go, then I guess I'll have to join the rest of the US in counting down until my American-made shows start coming back.

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It really is a shame that the most positive thing about Jack/Ianto is its existence.

Yeah, never mind giving the relationship substance or figuring out how to write half of its actual participants. There's random making out! What more do we want??

The wretched Torchwood audiobook I was listening to has a part where Jack kisses an injured Ianto on the forehead, and I went, "Awwww" (out loud in the middle of an intersection, but that's another story) and immediately hated myself for being such a sucker, but god, that's the kind of thing I'd like to see, you know? Or alternately, maybe an exploration of why that sort of thing doesn't happen. Just something! Something that makes it more than extremely modest gay porn!

Extremely modest gay porn totally needs to go on an icon.

I'm going to get my bitch on now.

I think the love of Jack/Ianto in fandom is out of proportion to what we get in canon. I think it's because it's a gay or m/m or bi or whatever ship and a lot of people who like slash are hanging onto it as a canon ship and ignoring the icky parts of it. This is also terribly common in Ten/Rose (note distinction) in Doctor Who with the obvious difference of the (apparent to observers) genders.

And just word to the Ianto stuff. There is no there there. He's a cipher. And my bitchy side is convinced that's why he's so damn popular - cipher = easily Mary Sue-able.

ITA to the nth power. (Also, Firefox is not flagging "nth" as a misspelling. Nifty.) I mean, I was blinded myself at first by "OMG CANON SLASH YAY." But as I got better acquainted with the show, I started noticing things like how badly the relationship is written (much like Ianto, it's written so blankly that people can put whatever they want into it, which is where half the damn wank comes from), how creepy it is when you think about it, what with the power dynamics and Ianto being completely fucked up from everything that has happened (this is, in fact, the view of the relationship that I subscribe to, but the show won't touch it), and how no one writes anything else and gyaergh. OH, and as of last ep, Ianto is canonically confirmed as having been born in August 1983 (I do not consider that a spoiler), which makes him TWENTY-FOUR right now and twenty-two when he came to work for Torchwood Three so he's practically a CHILD into the bargain and doesn't that just amplify the creep factor a tad? ~~Plus this makes him younger than me and that is just not on.~~

Argh, stupid cipher baby Ianto. Characters with no definable personality are SO hard to write. I mean, even the crudest of stereotypes is SOMETHING to work with, but with Ianto it's all a fractured mess and all I know for sure is that I refuse to write him as a wimp.

Thanks for saying that. AT least when it comes from an actual fan of the couple it's not just me being a bitch. (Which isn't to say I'm not one, mind you.)

I wouldn't call myself a fan of the couple so much as someone who really really WANTS to be a fan of the couple but, between the bad writing and the fact that you can't move in fandom without tripping over J/I fic, I've really been turned off them.

But, yes, I can confirm that you don't have to violently dislike Ianto to be frustrated with this pairing. ;)